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guitar solo not sitting

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Topic guitar solo not sitting
Hey everyone whats up?
I've been looking through the forums looking for an answer to my question, as well as looking on the net to see if I can find some pointers.
My buddy and I just recorded a killer tune in Cool Edit Pro 2.0. All the levels and everything sound great, untill the solo comes in.
I cant seem to get it to sit right. It kind of makes everything sound like shyte when it comes in. What I mean by this is, as soon as it comes in you can hear a noticeable "?fuzzy?" sound. Basically it sounds like nasty clipping.
Now, I've tried the tricks that everyone has mentioned about getting vocals to sit in the mix, I thought maybe this would help, but it didnt really. I've soloed the solo tracks and there is no clipping or anything, everything sounds great, I've also taken note of all my eq values on the other tracks as to avoid clashing.
I just cant seem to make it sit well.
I dont want it to just sit in the mix, I want it to come out and raise above the rest of the track, but, it's just not happening.
Sorry for the novel I've just written, I just want to make sure all of you know whats happening.
So if anyone can help it would be greatly appreciated.
Can't wait till September, Im starting Music Industry Arts here in my home town at Fanshawe College and Im sure I'll learn everything I need to know there, but for right now, I am stumped.

LAter,
Bones.
2
If there is definately no clipping on the track, than I would assume that it's either 1 of 2 things.

1. What plug-ins are you running? Are they boosting the gain to a clipping point? Often when you're close to clipping, if you apply an Eq boost to a certain frequency, it could throw the track over the clip level.

Or

2. What is the approximate level of your entire mix? If you're levels are starting to get over unity gain, when you try to raise the volume of the solo track, it might be pushing too much out of your output.

Try grouping all of the tracks except the guitar solo and bringing them all down a few dB instead of turning up the solo track.
3
Bones-

Can you post an audio clip of the offending track? You'd need a web host somewhere....

If you can't, email me the track and I'll give it a listen.
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
4
Awesome guys, thanks for the responses. Im going to go ahead and try whay you suggested, I think what you said about boosting certain eq's might be the culprit.

Axeman, I dont know if I could email it to you, it's a decent size file. I know there are a bunch of hosting sites but I cant think of any off of the top of my head. I know you recommended one to me a couple of months back and I got everything set up through there, but of course, now I cant remember the site at all. Do you happen to remember which site it is??

Anyways, I really appreciate the help.

Thanks,

Bones.
5
www.nowhereradio.com ? That's where my stuff is hosted...
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
6
cool. thanks.
I got it posted there.

the link is: https://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=4318&alid=-1

thanks again Axeman.


Bones.
7
My God I Got It!!!!

Mac, I didnt even think about the fact that all of my levels together was so red that it was almost brown!!! lol

Anyways, I updated the NoWhere RAdio site. Take a listen and let me know what you guys think. Keep in mind that I had to save it as a 128 K MP3 to make it fit on the site. I would really appreciate it.

Thanks again guys. I really cant tell you how grateful I am that you guys share your experiences with me.


Thanks,

Bones.

https://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=4318&alid=-1
8
Bones-

Nice chops. Not really my style, but nicely done. Good tone, too.

A few notes-

1. The is no stereo separation in the mix. It sounds like everything is panned right up the middle. At best, your stereo field is VERY narrow. Since you are going for the "wall of guitars" sound, that means that pretty much everything in the mix is in the same frequency range. You need to give each track a space of its own. I would use eq, pan, and a very small amount of reverb or delay to give things some space. Use the pan to create the stereo soundstage horizontally, use the reverb or delay to move things forward or back within the soundstage. Use the EQ to keep from getting things too muddy and having the guitars step on each other. Did you record the guitars in mono or stereo? If stereo, make sure that the L/R tracks are panned so that there is a lot of separation between them. I prefer to record guitars in mono. Easier to place in the mix.

2. The drum patch is really dry, and IMHO doesn't fit the genre of the song. That may just be a style choice on your part, and that's fine, but even if you decide to use this patch, you need to find a way to get it to fit in the mix better. The drum kit, too, seemed to be mono.

3. A four minute song without a single drum fill SCREAMS drum machine...... I would make sure you get some fills in there, and maybe a bridge that goes cut time to add some interest and drama to the song.

4. So far as the lead goes, it doesn't sit right because it has no place to sit (see number one above). It also still sounds distorted to me (not the good kind of distortion). Solo it and see what the levels are on the master bus. Then disable plugins one at a time until that buzzy sound quits. I wouldn't do anything too drastic to it until you address the above problems, though.

Overall, I think you have a lot of potential. The guitar tone is really good, and it's hard to capture that "scoop" guitar tone. The chops are pretty good, too. So now you just gotta learn how to record it!!
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
9
I also just had a thought- what are you using for monitors?

I'ts possible that your monitors or your room setup (or both) are lying to your ears.......
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
10
Axeman, I think I know what the problem may be then now that I read that.

The guitars were recorded in stereo and I just used the pan to pan the stereo track to the left or right, which would probably leave some of the opposite side still coming through. lol, I dont even know how to say what Im thinking. I'll state that in the form of a question:

If I have a stereo guitar track, and I pan it in Cool Edit to 72 left, would that mean that there would still be some levels coming out of the right side? like say 28?

Im gonna try and mono the guitar tracks to see if that has any effect, which Im guessing it will.

Thanks a lot,

Bones.

Oh and BTW, that un-Godly drum track is a loop that is just there to keep time. I just use those until my drummer has a chance to sit in and add his parts.
11
If you recorded the guitar tracks in stereo, and you collpase them to mono, you will loose whatever mod effects you may have had on there whe you recorded (another reason to record dry!!), i.e. chorus or flange. This my produce some wierd artifacts. Try it and see.

A beter way to do the huge guitar thing would be to record a mono track, then double it by playing it again (NOT just cloning it within the program). If you double it (or even triple it) this way, and your playing is tight, you will get a HUGE guitar sound that you can position at will without losing anything.
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
12
Those guitar tracks were recorded dry so I dont think I'll have a problem with that.
I monoed all the tracks and spaced them out abit more.
Tell me if this sounds a bit better. I think it does.

https://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=4318&alid=-1
13
It does sound better, but it's still not right. I detect no stereo field- everything sounds pretty much straight up the middle. Are you sure you don't have an "export as mono" option checked somewhere?
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
14
Axeman, I couldnt find anything like that in the options or settings or anything, and I do agree with what you say.
I can hear a little bit of a spread but like you said, it doesn't sound "right" It does sound thick, but that's just because of the 4 guitar tracks. Maybe the spread on the guitar tracks isnt wide enough. I have two of them all the way right and left, and the other two at 70 left and right. I have the drum track, which is a loop up the middle, as well as the bass and the leads including the solo.
The way Im placing them in the middle is, I monoed all the tracks, I put the drums at left 1 and right 1, the bass at L5 and R5, and the leads at L2 and R2. I know that you have mentioned before to me to pan certain tracks to say 7 o'clock, but to be honest I cant figure that out. I understand what you mean, but I just cant seem to translate that into a left and right "number"
Im gonna fool around with the guitar placements a bit more to see if I can come up with something.

Thanks,

Bones.
15
Just for experimentation, try mixing with a set of headphones. I normally wouldn't recommend it, but if you take a mono track and pan it hard left, you should only hear it in the left earpiece.

You said you did that, but I didn't hear anything that was hard left or right in the mix...........
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
16
I noticed that as well. With my headpones on, I can pan something say 2 left and it sounds the same as if I had it panned all the way left, so Im not sure what the problem is.
I've been reading the help section and manual non stop lately and I really cant find anything that addresses this.
I guess I'll just keep messing with it.

Thanks,

Bones.
17
What's the range on the pan? I'm running Cakewalk, and it's 1-128, with 64 being up the middle. Also, there is also an option in Cake to set the pan pot for constant volume, so that the perceived volume is the same wherever you have the pan set.
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
18
Maybe thats what the problem is. Because if Im not mistaken, isnt the sound supposed to get louder the further you pan it from the center?
I tried something that seemed to work a bit better:
I panned the Left guitar track to 20 Right, and the guitar track still came into my left earphone but it seemed to be closer to the middle and quieter, which is exactly what we're going for. So maybe I should do this untill I can get this figured out. Or, maybe that's just the way it's supposed to work in CEP 2.0 though I doubt it.
I panned the bass tracks 10 in the opposite direction and they sounded like they were coming right from the middle.
Also, CEP's panning goes from 0-100 Left or Right.

I'll post the new track on No-Where a bit later today so you can take a listen to it and see what I mean.

Thanks,

Bones.
19
Hey Axeman, I posted the revised version of the tune on No Where. I think it sounds a bit better. You can really notice the spread when all of the guitars and bass come in right after the intro. I used the method that I was explaining before with panning the tracks to the opposite side.
Would you mind taking a listen and letting me know what you think.

Thank You,

Bones.

https://www.nowhereradio.com/artists/album.php?aid=4318&alid=-1
20
MUCH better!!! 8)

Next, I'd work on your relative levels and some creative eq as well as finding pan spots between hard L/R and the center.

What I mean is, now that you've figured out how to move tracks horizontally across the sound stage, you want to use some creative eq to "unjam" the frequency spectrum as well as maybe small amounts of reverb or delay to move the tracks forward (closer- zero verb/delay) or back (further away on the stage- i.e. with some delay or reverb)

Listen to the new mix on a set of cans with your eyes closed. Try to picture it as a real stage that your band is on. Try to target a spot in your minds eye where you want to put the guy playing a certain track, and then see if you can put him there......

Ideally, you want each track to have it's own "space" in the overall soundstage where nothing is competing with it or stepping on it.
The Axeman (##(===> Cuts From My New Blues CD
21
I'll get right on it!!

I love this sh!t!! lol :D

I thought playing and writing music was fun. Now Im starting to think that mixing it is a lot more interesting.

Thanks Axeman, I appreciate your help!

Later,

Bones.